*sits down with a turkey sandwich*

I make a great 'Turkey-Rice' vegetable soup, Turkey Tetrazzini, fried turkey balls (not nads) - I mean the list of disguises is endless, but sooner or later people quit falling for it and start bringing home...Krystal burgers. That is a pretty huge signal that they won't tolerate another dish with turkey sneaked into it - and the day that the dogs and cats get their feast.

So how is everyone after the holidays?

I have one slice of pumpkin pie left for breakfast tomorrow, then I will have to console myself with eggnog in my coffee until Christmas.

Eggnog?! Ew. It's like off-flavored, thick milk.

Mmmmmmm egg nog!! I love it so... but I'm allergic :/ Allergies be damned, I'm going to sneak drink it anyway!

As for turkey, we're having it again. I personally don't mind, but my mom and my brother do. So when they ask what's for dinner I get to deal with the groans! Next year I think I'll talk my dad out of buying two turkeys!

I don't mind turkey. *shrug*

I'm jealous of all the American users here who got have turkey in November.

I've got a question for any of the kitty owners.

With Melaina, usually I have her food bowl constantly filled with food. I feel bad when its empty because what if she's hungry and her bowl isn't full? Well, my brothers do this for their cats and my mom does this for hers and all of those cats are rather plump. Cute, but plump.

Does it work better to have a set feeding time? I get emails from a cat advice site and they mentioned a set time to help the cats go to bed at night (does this work? Hell is it possible?). Or is it fine to keep her bowl constantly filled so she can eat as she pleases? She never overdoes it. She's more of a snacker.

I fill Piper's bowl once a day with a full cup. Usually near the end of the day before I head to bed. Somedays he has it empty when I come home from work, others there's still some in it. I force myself to keep his amount down, partially due to not being able to let him really run in my small apartment for exercise. His check up had him at the ideal weight for his age.

Biggest problem with this is he has on occasion eaten too much and throws up. Most of the time he's good about not getting too much.

Piper's something of a slacker himself. He's pretty happy with chilling on the bed/couch back/laptop.

As long as she doesn't over do it, your method should be fine.

I put 3/4 cup of dry food out in each cat's bowl every morning. If they clean it up, I'll add some more, just so they always have some dry to fall back on.

Every evening I split up a can of wet cat food between them and give them another 1/4th cup of dry food once they've finished the wet.

The outside cats sleep at night feeding this way, but the inside cat stays up all night and sleeps all day. There is no way to train a cat to sleep nights, either they will or they won't.

As far as the feeding goes - if your cat is maintaining its weight properly, there is no reason to limit and schedule their dry food. (and spayed/neutered cats will "plump out," that is to be expected to a certain degree - just as long they don't become obese there is no reason to be concerned over a light plumping).

The wet food should be on a schedule and limited though, because whatever time you feed it one day (they will expect it every day at that time) - and they will overeat it if it is made available all the time.

Okay, okay, okay.

Not to toot my own horn, but I am rather knowledgeable about feeding cats, being a veterinarian and all.

Lesson number one: Cats are evolved for a feast and famine existence. That means their bodies are evolved to pig out until their bellies are dragging on the ground, then go without until they catch their next meal, which may not be for a couple of days. That's right. Days. So the idea that the food bowl must always have food in it is complete bogus.

Lesson number two: Cats know they are smarter than humans. That is why they guilt trip their owners when they go to the food bowl and find it *gasp* empty of food. How dare you neglect your responsibilities as my slave and submissive! Don't fall for that!

Lesson number three: The myth that cats know when to stop eating is just that: a myth. Again, this goes back to the lifestyle they have evolved into - they will eat until full, because they don't know when they will eat again. The whole thing starts all over again when that food bowl is filled, because they still don't know when they will eat again. Even when you know their next feeding time, they don't. Cats don't live by the clock like we mortal fools do. In other words, cats eat because the food is there.

Now for the specific advice you've gotten so far, Jacki:

Lil, are you speaking of a measuring cup of food once daily? I don't know where you live, but here in the States a measuring cup is about 8 ounces. If Piper is maintaining an ideal weight, great, but I would look hard at the diet you're feeding him. My own two (average sized at between 10 and 11 lbs) thrive on less than half a measuring cup a day. The fact that there is still food in his bowl tells me that you are probably overfeeding him on a daily basis. Ideally he should finish all of his food within ten to twenty minutes. You might find that as Piper gets older, his weight may start creeping up. Also, the cheaper diets are high in carbohydrates, and we are finding that cats who get too much carbs in their diets are at greater risk for diabetes. I am glad that Piper is at a good weight for his age, though I don't know much else about him.

KC: no, free choice feeding as Jacki describes it is not fine for cats. It really isn't fine for anyone, be they cats, dogs or humans. Obesity is the number one health problem facing pets in the US, and we are seeing a rise in diseases associated with this condition. The problem is, people think cats don't overeat. They do. I see waaay too many cats who do. And it is so much harder to get weight off of a cat than it is to prevent it from adding up in the first place. And there is another reason free choice feeding increases the risk of diabetes in cats. It has to do with how cats digest their food.

mALX: You are feeding a lot of food to your outside cats. That's fine, actually - they burn more calories than our pampered indoor kitties. Just trying to stay warm in the winter weather can really consume calories at a crazy rate. And it is possible to get indoor cats sleeping at night. Most indoor cats, though, sleep during the day. Why is that? It's because most indoor cats are home alone during the day. When the family comes home, they wake up and become more active because they are interacting with us. So to get them to sleep at night, you've got to keep them up and active during the day. And don't rely on the dogs to do it - they will sleep during the day too! The fact that spayed/neutered cats always plump up is another fallacy I hear a lot about. I've seen plenty of intact males/females who were overweight, as well as lean alters (my own fall in the latter camp). What happens is most pets are spayed/neutered at about six months of age, a point in their development when their metabolic rates start to slow down ANYWAY. A young kitten has about four times the metabolic activity as a full grown adult. That is why you have to cut back so much on their food as they mature. It has nothing really to do with the presence/absence of gonads. The reason so many feral intact cats are lean is because they spend more time looking to get laid than they do looking to fill their bellies. And intact females are usually pregnant, lactating and raising a litter of squirts all at the same time, so they are even busier.

And another thing, mALX: canned (wet) food actually has less calories than dry food per unit weight. One ounce of canned cat food will have a fraction of the calories than an ounce of dry cat food. That's because canned food is about 70 percent water, and we all know that water has zero calories. If we were to take an ounce of dry food, and let's say that ounce has 100 calories. Then we add enough water to that ounce to make it 70% water and 30% food, it will end up being about 3.33 ounces total and still have just 100 calories. So an ounce of that mixture of water and dry food, which is basically what canned food is, will have a third of the calories of an ounce of dry food alone. The main reason we recommend limiting the canned food is to minimize dental tartar buildup on the cat's teeth. Also, leaving canned food out at room temp for more than an hour causes the food to spoil.

So Jacki, to answer your question, I would suggest feeding your cats the way I do - small amounts twice daily. No more often than that - free choice feeding leads to insulin depletion and therefore diabetes. Don't go there if you can help it. I feed my kitties Wellness diet (the Indoor kitty formula) because it is low in carbs and reasonably high in fats and protein. The one cat gets three tenths of an ounce of dry food (yes, 0.3 ounce) mixed with a quarter can of canned food twice a day; the older one who hates wet food gets 0.6 ounce twice daily. Both have been maintaining their weights just fine on that feeding schedule.

A high quality diet means that your cat will age more gracefully. I fed my first pair Science Diet, and when I brought my 12 year old cat in for a dental cleaning, no one could believe he was that old - he looked four!

I don't mean to sound harsh, but I get tired of seeing all kinds of well-intentioned advice out there that are not appropriate or just plain wrong. So I can not sit idly by and let this continue on this forum. I hope that all of you take this in the spirit in which it was intended - as an education from one who is qualified to give it. Now I'm sure I've raised even more questions, so feel free to ask here, or PM me. I will be happy to discuss things further!

Ok...Indra and Bastian get their breakfast (wet food) every morning between 6 and 7, depending how lazy I am! Then they get fresh water in a big bowl and a small bowl with dry food. They are neutered (and spayed) so I don't want them to put on too much weight. They are indoor cats and Indra is kinda lazy so she has become quite a big kitty, she weighs 5,2 kg and she's 18 months! Of course Norwegian Forest cats ARE big...and Indra's father is quite a lion (A Norwegian Norwegian Forest cat, very big!) Also she has now grown her winter fur so she looks huge! She also has a good appetite! ahem...

Bastian is more fond of running around and playing with everything, he also manages to get Indra going thank god!

Well they eat their breakfast, and then i go to work....When I come home they usually get supper between 5 and 8 pm..depending of if they tell me they're hungry....Yes they do! Very clearly. They get their wet food and a small bowl of dry food for the night. If they want a snack...(They usually do)

The amount of wet food is one pouch in the morning and one in the evening, so they consume about 100g a day each! Not so much but they are NOT skinny....oh no...They get about 1,5 dl dry food in the morning and 1,5 dl in the evening....Oh and of course they get some cat treats before I leave in the morning..and when I come home. Not much but still....

Oh yes..they sleep at night...and also during the day.. I presume

I bow to the vet.

Our cat gets some wet food in the morning (someone else does that) and then I give her some dry food at night before I go to bed.

Piper's 21 months old or so. (He's a foundling so exact age was guessed by the local vet, breed wasn't tried) He weighs in at 13lbs and I was told that was good for him. I do mean a measuring cup, I use Purina Indoor cat formula and it recommends 3/4-1 1/4 cups a day. Most of the time he's emptied out his bowl 2-3 hours before the 9pm feeding time. If, as you say, it's not ideal, then I'll go up to the 1 1/4 cup a day.

KC: Sounds like you're on the right track with the feeding. Be sure not to give too much of the dry - it's really easy to overdo. Canned's more forgiving - after all, it's 70% water! Be consistent with the amounts of the dry you feed, and over time you will see how it goes.

Lil - As a big-boned adult (sounds like that's what he is - Norwegies like Minque's Indra tend to be very large), 13 lbs is not unreasonable. I would go down on the amount fed, not up. You want him to eat it all within 20 - 30 minutes after you put it down, not take all day to eat it.

At everyone: Remember when reading the recommended feeding guidelines on the food labels that these guidelines are formulated for very active cats (who are also intact, so they're busy seeking sex over food); our typical sedentary couch potatoes actually need very, very little. If you have outdoor kitties, such as mALX, then those feeding guidelines are probably spot on. This is also very true of dog food and doggies.

Lil, you may want to go down to 1/2 cup a day, but no less. He's a good sized boy, and if the vet says he's at his ideal weight, then he'll need a little bit more than my own 10 - 11 pounders.

Purina is not the best brand out there, but it is quite decent. And your feeding pattern (once a day) tells me Piper won't be as likely to suffer from feline urologic syndrome (i.e. blocked tom cat). I see this more in obese cats (because they can't get back there and clean themselves as well) as well as those cats that are free-choice fed.

And one very important concept to remember: it is the number of calories fed that matter, not how (canned versus dry) or the amount of food (1/2 cup, 0.7 ounces, etc). This is because different brands of food have different formulas, and therefore have different calories per unit weight (i.e. per ounce).

So I got a little surprise yesterday when I was gleefully opening Christmas cards. A lot of our friends use or include a photo of the kids/pets/themselves vacationing in an exotic locale/some combination of the previous. Well, on the front of one of the cards, looking sweaty and grinning as if she had just climbed a mountain and then downed half a bottle of champagne, was a picture of me.

After an extended WTF moment, I realized that the friend had probably used on-demand printing to create individualized cards, and hopefully the only other people who had gotten this one are the other friends in the photo. (All of them look better than me by the way, especially Mr. Grits. In my defense he has longer legs so he took fewer steps, the mountain was easier to climb on his side of the trail, and I think he made me drink most of our bottle when we got to the top.) That would give me comfort, except I know that my other friend in the picture, let’s call her “The Pretty One,” displays her cards all over the front hall just like I do, so everyone she knows will get to see it. Also she looks like she whipped out a flatiron and touched up her hair on the mountaintop right before the picture. And she’s wearing makeup. I’m sure she’ll put that card right in the middle. Dammit.

We’ll see them all on New Year’s Eve, so I have a little time to plot my revenge. Although maybe I should use my energy trying not to do anything that will be featured on next year’s card.

I saw a very cute picture of you holding a chicken. Maybe you should enclose that in a card and quickly send that picture of yourself out to all her friends (just in case they got that picture too) and the cover picture can be one of her with her head in the toilet getting a "swirly" after you stick it in there and flush. All the ironing in the world can't hold up to a swirly in progress, lol.

Bless your heart! I can't stand really bad pictures being taken without my knowledge and then sent to others - my red-headed temper would fly on that, lol.

PS: You have an AWESOME grin, I bet the picture is great in spite of your description !!

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Oh Grits! Your grin is infectious, and reading your delightful tale of misfortune has made my morning. Cleaning the coffee from monitor and keyboard is well worth the chuckles. What delightful glimpses you provide into Gritsworld.

Gaaah !! Does she have a picture posted? GAAAAAH !!

Ahh words of wisdom from the Vet! Me like! Yes Indra is really large! But i can still sense her spine and ribcage if I peek through all that winter fur she's got...without pressing my fingers onto her. I feed them Hill's Science Plan, wet food pouches(100g) and also Hill's Science Plan dry food, normal, not diet! Diet I've heard contains too much grain and since felines are carnivores...well. I also give them Hill's vetessential's dry food. They like it!
Combined with that I also give them a swedish cat food named Mjau, (translated:meow) which is high in animal protein content. I'm considering to turn them over to BARF (raw food you make yourselves) has anyone experience from that? Indra's sister who is in a cattery in Italy is eating that kinda food. Isadora was smaller when she was pregnant this summer than Indra is now! Ooops...

Guilty as sin, right there. I'm so easily guilted by those big, perfect green eyes!

Thanks so much for your insight I'll do my best to not fall for those adorable mews, especially once she gets spayed.

I was gently awakened this morning by ghosts that perished seventy years ago today. Although they were unknown to me, their profession was not, and my heart aches for them. They described the explosions, fire and sounds of breaking steel as warships, so mighty as to be named after entire states, sought a watery grave.

These warriors were not thinking the lofty truisms of politicians or historians like ‘freedom isn’t free’ or that the attack would awaken a nation with a bloody history to ‘unleash hell’, or even that the day would ‘live in infamy’. Rather, their last thoughts were focused on controlling their terror while fighting to save their mates and ships. Some did manage a quiet “I love you,” whispered into the chaos - with the hope it would be carried to a heart that did not yet realize it would be broken this day.

What a touching tribute. For me this day is not just a reminder of the men that died in 1941, but to the military that we have all lost in these more recent conflicts in the gulf. Having a son over there myself right now, today is particularly significant because it is a reminder of his vulnerability in spite of the numbers around him. My prayer is for blessings to the lost and their families, and protection for those still in harms way.

Amen, brother!

Profound words to quiet a restless soul, beautiful and poignant. Thank you Acadian a beautiful tribute.

The men and women who have given their lives for their country are heroes and should all be honored as such but the loved ones they leave behind are no less the heroes for their sacrifice to the same.

My heartfelt thanks goes out to all of the men and women of the armed forces that serve this great nation and to their families for the day to day fear each of them face with their loved ones far from home in danger's path. Stay safe and may God bless you one and all.

Welp, I'm going to bed. Big Contracts exam tomorrow morning. Wish me luck, guys!

Best of luck on the exams platypus. Don't over think it! hehe

Good luck!

The best of luck that you ace it like a pro !!!

Holding a good thought for you, platypus!

In keeping with the "feel" of Skyrim (and the chill in the air) built the first fire of the season. Splitting wood in RL does not seem to yield materials to improve my archery skill... sigh.

Went brilliantly. At least, I think it did. That's up to my professor.

One major problem with law school: I can't get Skyrim because I know for a fact that it will wreck my grades. Same problem applies to lawyers, who for the most part have no spare time. It's a good thing I'm insane enough to kinda enjoy this (at the same time that I'm howling into the abyss and cursing every moment I breathe).

That's all right, depending on what kind of law you specialize in, it is possible other people will be cursing and howling with you. Contracts sounds like business law, that will keep you safe from the howlers and cursers, lol. Congrats on ace-ing your exam !!

Well, taking Contracts means nothing so far as my future choice of law goes - you don't choose your classes in your first year. Everyone takes Civil Procedure, for instance - even people who will never be litigators.

Like Latin business terms, lol. Anyway, so glad you aced it - and knew you would !!

Exam #2 is tomorrow morning - this one is Torts. Must say I'm beginning to regret only doing three hours of studying on Saturday and then watching Battlestar Galactica because I just. Couldn't. Do it anymore.

Believe me, I know exactly what you are talking about!

Took my Marketing Management final yesterday. It was online, so I had until Thursday midnight to take it. But I wanted to just get it out of the way and enjoy a few extra days off on top of my holiday break. No school now until Jan 2nd!

After some discussion with friends, we made an important decision.

Quentin Tarantino needs to make a Christmas movie. Admit it, it would be awesome.

I am sure you meant legal wrongs, but all I could think of was...a chocolate torte





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Er...is this a Christmas movie where he murders Santa Claus? Holds him in a dungeon and tortures him for toys? Or he could play Herod in a more Nativity based Christmas movie...URK !!!

All that said, I was shocked at the versitility of John Travolta, who went the opposite direction (from playing a baby-faced kid and dufus to an evil character that made mass murderous espionage look like child's play).

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Lol mALX I was thinking the same thing. My cousin going to be taking that test probably has taken that test now.

I know, just reading that comment sent me on a chocolate eating binge of hot cocoa with a melted chocolate santa in it (instead of marshmallows).

Mmm...delicious torts...

That leaves two more to go - one of 'em's take-home exam with a time limit (trust me, this doesn't make it a picnic).

When does the Latin exam come in? Now that one is fun! (Unlike the Contracts exam).

bbqplatypus: Congratulations on the exam, and good luck with the other ones. To be honest I really don't understand how anyone could ever want to study law, it seems so boring. But to each his own I suppose

Rant begins here:
I could do with some Christmas break right about now, but I don't have time. :facepalm: Had the national maths test today, which hopefully means that maths will slow down a bit(at least until next term when I begin to study the next level) . I've also got a chemistry test tomorrow, not really worried about it because it has mostly been repetitions from last year, but it's still tedious. And I've decided to do the exams for English early, since that will give me a couple hours extra free time once I'm done with it, and I'm not really learning anything in class. So I'm currently working on a reading journal for that, and waiting for the teachers to figure out what more I'm supposed to do. Yeah, because of the new school system they don't know exactly what I'll have to do to take the exams early. But they're going to talk about it on Monday. Then there is the social science project, and the other English project I'll have to do about English culture to fulfill the culture criteria... You wouldn't happen to know of any foods/drinks from Australia or New Zealand would you? Recipes possibly? We've also got an P.E assignment, but since the teacher haven't given me any instructions I can't do it.

Positive thing: When I told my teacher I write a lot of stories in English she said I could use a part for the exams. Now I've just got to choose a story...

Why is it that the teachers wait with all the big projects until you've only got about a month left of school? Sure, I chose to do the earlier exams myself, and they can't move the national tests, but what about all the other stuff? Couldn't they create a nice pattern where everything is split up over the term, so that we don't go rolling our thumbs the first month and then have our brains going kaboom in the last month!? Ehhh...
Rant ends.

I feel like my brain is working overtime...

I know how you feel Saquira... Over the past week, I've done a month's worth of notes (an impressive 40 pages), studied well over ten hours for a test... have an essay, have to take a test the day after the break.

Anyways, I'm glad to be back and able to see my friends again

To all of you bbqplatypus, Saquira and Zalphon:

THANK YOU!!!!! The reminder that I am only the study partner for my children is one more thing to be thankful for, whew.

I do wish you all the best of luck on your exams!!!!!

In addition to my grueling exam schedule, I also received other news today. My brother has received a nomination from Michelle Bachmann to attend West Point. Hopefully, this will be followed by news that he's been accepted (though it's not a sure thing yet). We wait and hope. I'm really proud of him no matter what happens.

As well you should be! Here's hoping the acceptance comes through!

One last exam. A take-home on property, which I will be receiving at 4:00 pm on Thursday and will have six hours to complete. And still I feel like I don't have enough time. Gulp.