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Decrepit
QUOTE(SubRosa @ Dec 5 2019, 03:18 PM) *

QUOTE(Decrepit @ Dec 5 2019, 04:10 PM) *

I settled on The Summer Tree, book one of The Fionavar Tapestry by Guy Gavriel Kay. I'm not far in, and find it slow going. For one thing, it's a book I like very much. I've read it six times before, most recently late 2015. That's a problem, in that I remember it TOO well. (A great rarity for me.) Also, it begins with a trope I'm not overly fond of - persons from this world and time being transported to an alternate reality, where they not only survive and thrive, but become movers and shakers in that world. I rarely find this scenario convincing. As fine a writer as Kay is, the lead-up to the crossing doesn't convince here. I thought so my initial read. Subsequent reads haven't convinced me otherwise. That said, once in their new environment things begin to improve. Pretty soon I'll be as hooked as ever. Or so I hope.

I read the first two books of the Tapestry around a decade or more ago. So they are a little fuzzy now. But I recall feeling that there were just too many characters. They each did not seem to get enough time individually to show their adaptations and growth in the new world. Instead the story seemed to rush through their various acclimations. I think it would have been a better story with only one protagonist, or at the most two, so that a lot more attention could have been given to their development.

Interesting comment. I hadn't considered single vs multi protagonists in literature before. Had someone asked me about it out-of-the-blue, I'd have announced myself neutral on the subject. However, thinking back on the many novels I've read, a large percentage of favorites fall in the 'multi viewpoints' camp. Enough so to consist in a preference. Maybe a substantial preference. Don't know where I'm going with this...or if it means much of anything other than the obvious.
Decrepit
At 1310 this afternoon, lying on the sofa, I concluded my seventh read of Guy Gavriel Kay's The Summer Tree, book one of The Fionavar Tapestry. Good as ever!, with the caveat of feeling the movement-between-realities opening section left something to be desired. Took longer to finish than it should have, mainly due being a read-while-abed person who can rarely lie down long without being bothered by some combo of neck and/or shoulder and/or upper back pain.

Book two, The Wandering Fire, sits on the sofa waiting my return.
Decrepit
At 2058 yesterday evening, during one of my infrequent, failed, attempts to lie comfortably on my back in bed, I finished my seventh read of Gay Gavriel Kay's The Wandering Fire, book two of The Fionavar Tapestry. I read much of the third, final book's intro last night before falling asleep, and am now several pages into chapter one of The Darkest Road.

Fionavar is, of course, much influenced by Tolkien. I find it is at least as heavily influenced by Silmarillion as LOTR, maybe more so. Which is fitting, considering Kay cut his teeth helping Christopher Tolkien prepare Silmarillion for publication.
SubRosa
Isn't pretty much all fantasy fiction heavily inspired by Tolkien? The evil Dark Lord rises to threaten the world with his seemingly unstoppable hordes of henchmen, while the squabbling factions of the ragtag Army of Light must put aside their differences and unite to heroically save the day against all odds, usually by exploiting some magical macguffin super weapon, often by turning said weapon against the Dark Lord?

I am not saying this is a bad story. Many writers have taken it, added interesting characters, their own unique world, and made it a fun ride. Take Star Wars. It is Tolkien in space.
haute ecole rider
And Tolkein himself was heavily influenced by the Icelandic saga The Eddas, so you could say most modern fantasy owes a great debt to the mythology of the Norsemen. Having read a translation of this saga, I can vouch for LOTR's and Silmarilion's roots in this ancient tale.

I'm sure other European tribes had their own sweeping mythological/fantastical traditions, but unfortunately much of these appear to have been subsumed or obscured by the hagiography of the Catholic Church.

Lately I've been seeking out fantasies that are inspired by what I call "nontraditional" sources - a series inspired by the Russian folk tales of witches and Rusalkas, another trilogy inspired by ancient Indian (the Asian subcontinent, not the American) tales, yet another inspired by old Chinese fables, and a most excellent series inspired by ancient Egyptian and Bedouin tales, and so on. After becoming jaded on the usual sword and sorcery fantasy tale years ago, I find these "new" traditions so much more interesting and even refreshing.

Currently, however, I'm reading something far removed from fantasy - The Personal Memoirs of Ulysses Simpson Grant, Complete. As a history buff, I find the recounting of Civil War events from one man's perspective, and that of a general to be very interesting. I finished the section concerning his C.W. years this morning, and felt rather awed by his recounting of Lee's surrender at Appomattox.

The recounting of the last twenty years of his life should go rather quickly. It's a good thing I found this book and purchased it, otherwise, had it been a library book it would have taken me much longer to finish it, what with losing it every two weeks and having to place a hold on it and waiting for it to become available again!


SubRosa
One of the things that really struck me about US Grant was his retelling of Battle of Belmont. It was a little nothing skirmish that was only undertaken as a demonstration to distract the Confederates from another operation elsewhere. Grant describes leading his men up a hill where the Confederates were encamped. The entire time he was just waiting for them to open fire, getting more and more terrified with every step. Then they got to the top and found that the Confederates and fled.

That made him realize that the enemy was just as afraid of him, as he was of them. At that point he stopped worrying about what they would do. Instead he only thought about what he was going to do.
haute ecole rider
Yes, I remember that skirmish. He was a big fan of simultaneous operations, one intended to distract the enemy from the main strike elsewhere. Such as at Chattanooga, where he had his main army march across the river in sight of Confederate pickets, then turn and march behind a long ridge out of their vision. A bit later, while the main force was still behind the ridge, he had another sizable detachment march back across the river downstream, so it looked as if the main force was going somewhere else. Sneaky bastard's got my respect. wink.gif
Decrepit
At 2044 this evening, lying on the sofa, I finished my sixth read of Guy Gavriel Kay's The Darkest Road, concluding book of The Fionavar Tapestry. As with every reading of this book, my watered numerous time throughout, hardly stopping its last few pages.

At my brother's house Christmas morning, he gave me book bought and read several years ago but says he no longer has room for on his shelves. It's a biography of the actress Ava Gardner. I'm not much into celebrity bios, but accepted it as a more or less permanent loan he can reclaim at any time should he so choose. I might start in on it at bedtime (sofatime?) despite a lack of enthusiasm.
Dark Reaper
Though I haven't started reading it but I found the Stephen King book The Running Man and yes its the same as the one Arnold played in though the story is WAAAAAAY different.
Decrepit
At 1855 yesterday evening, 15 Jan 2020, I finished my fifth read of Marion Zimmer Bradley's The Firebrand, her take on the Trojan War, told from Kassandra's perspective.
Decrepit
Just found out Christopher Tolkien has passed away. sad.gif
SubRosa
I finished Das Reich, by Max Hastings. It is about the march of the 2nd SS Panzer "Das Reich", from where it was stationed in Toulouse on D-Day to Normandy. Allied planners expected it would reach Normandy in about 3 days. It took them 17 because of the Resistance.

A lot of the book is about the French Resistance in general. I had not realized it, but they were not nearly as unified or organized as I had imagined. Movies gives us the idea that there were all these Resistance cells lurking around France, each taking orders from London via radio sets. It was not nearly that nice. The Resistance were divided up into numerous factions. There were the Gaullists who actually did take their orders from DeGaulle in London. Then there were the Communists, who were supposedly under Free French command, but in reality did whatever they wanted to, hated DeGaulle, and planned on fighting their own civil war once they ejected the Germans.

Then there were roving bands of Maquisards. In the middle of the war the Germans decided to round up a bunch of French men and send them to Germany to work slave labor. A lot of men did not like the sound of that, so they ran off to the woods instead. They called themselves resistance fighters. But many were little more than outlaws, and often they had no desire to fight the Germans. They were just trying to survive the war.

The SOE and eventually the OSS sent people in to work with the various resistance groups. But they had little control over what the resistance did. The Resistance basically looked at them as a means to get guns and money, and little else. Some SOE people were able to motivate their groups into effective action. Many were not able to get them to really do anything. Some of said groups were extremely effective. Many of them got themselves killed in droves because they had no idea what they were doing.

Which brings us to the 2nd SS Panzer. They were pulled out of the line in the East and sent to France in the spring of 1944 to rebuild, and await the inevitable allied invasion. They had 15,000 men and 200 tanks when D-Day took place. It took them a day just to get going, because of all the confusion in the German general staff back in Berlin. Then once they did get going they started running into Resistance groups trying to slow them down.

The first team was very successful. They felled trees across the roads, and hid mines in said trees. So the Germans wold try to move the trees and blow themselves up. Then a Resistance machine gun hidden in the woods would open up on them. The SS men wold deploy to attack the Resistants in the trees, and the Resistants would run away. They did this over and over again for the entire time the panzer division was in their territory.

Probably the most effective thing was the French railworkers, who sabotaged the axles of the flatcars in the area that would be needed to carry the tanks north. They smeared an abrasive paste on their axles, that chewed them up whenever they moved. That wrecked all the flatcars, with no loss of life at all.

Other resistance teams did not do so well. Some just felled trees, which the Germans easily cleared and drove past. Some put up roadblocks and slugged it out. Which was suicide against a panzer division. In the town of Tulle the Communists decided to take over the entire town, and they managed to do it after a day's fighting. Then the Das Reich rolled in the next day, and took it back. They then hanged 99 of the townspeople as a reprisal. A few days later at the town of Orandur they murdered nearly 700 civilians, herding them into churches and setting them on fire, and the like.

In the end the resistance stopped attacking the Das Reich because it just cost too much in innocent lives. The last stab was from the SAS, who blew up a German petrol supply dump that the panzer division needed to continue moving north. But only a handful of them escaped being killed in return.

The book is ok. It provides a lot of information. But there are so many people involved that I could not keep all of the resistants and SS officers straight. It also had a habit of jumping around and going on side tracks. Still, it was very useful for my Stormcrow fic, as I will be using this event in the history of Blood Raven.
Decrepit
At 1421 this afternoon, 21 Jan 2020, I concluded my third read of Jonathan Wylie's Dreams of Stone. It pales in comparison to The Firebrand. An OK read to pass time with, little more. Still, I enjoyed it (just) enough to continue on with the series' second volume, The Center of the Circle. Only, I can't find it! I retain distinct memories of events contained within it and the concluding novel's pages, so know I own 'em. What's more, I chose to read Dreams primarily because it was within easy reach. The other two books 'should' be in the same location, thus easily found. Where are they?

Their loss is my gain, in that upon calling off the search I decided on a re-read of Guy Gavriel Kay's The Lions of Al-Rassan, which I began during tonight's supper. A favorite work by a favorite fantasy author.
Decrepit
I frequently visit the corner of YouTube oft called BookTube by its participants. These are mostly younglings, folk in their late teens to maybe early-mid thirties. A few days ago, searching for reviews / discussions of Stephen Donaldson's Thomas Covenant books (which until recently received next to no YT coverage) I got turned on to the channel of an older gentleman named Steve Donoghue who, as he himself states, does little these days but read. He's gained a reputation, which he denies, of having read 'everything.' Still, he's so well-read that a BookTuber recently created a "Has Steve Read It?" tag, which gained a good bit of traction within the community. Mr Donoghue decided to make video replies to each of them. Here's one such reply I particularly enjoy, fairly representative of them all.

Has Steve Read It?, The History Shelf Edition
macole
I read all the Thomas Covenant books. I thought that they were a refreshing change from likes of Sword of Shannara, and other Tolkien type fantasies.
Decrepit
Considering the day it is, I decided to treat myself to a voice recording of a section of The Hobbit, read by none other than JRR Tolkien himself. Even more fitting, the section in question concerns presents, or rather one particular 'present.'

JRR Tolkien reads from The Hobbit

QUOTE(macole @ Jan 26 2020, 12:12 AM) *

I read all the Thomas Covenant books. I thought that they were a refreshing change from likes of Sword of Shannara, and other Tolkien type fantasies.

I've read the first two 'trilogies' numerous times. They are, as I've likely mentioned before, the books that hooked me on fantasy during the mid 1980s. The much-later-published Final Chronicles is possibly my greatest literary disappointment. I've never been able to force myself to read it to completion.
King Of Beasts
Witcher books, just finished the The Last Wish, just started The Sword Of Destiny
Decrepit
At 1359 Friday, 31 Jan 2020, I concluded my fourth read of Guy Gavriel Kay's The Lions of Al-Rassan. It numbers amongst my favorite works by Kay, a favorite currently active author publishing within the fantasy genre. Like most of his post-Fionavar novels, events take place in a pseudo historical setting, in this case an equivalent to earth's Spanish Reconquest. (The Reconquista.) Fantastical elements are extremely lite, again the norm. As is often the case, I 'teared up' on numerous occasions, especially near the end.

I'm now taking another stab at Norma Lorre Goodrich's King Arthur, a book I've owned for decades but have never been able to get very far in. It purports to be a search for a historical Arthur, but comes across as pretentious rubbish. At least I've thought so during all previous reading attempts. This time I'm considering it as 'food for thought' not to be taken overly seriously. We'll see if this helps.

I've at least three book purchases planned. One is a compilation of three works by an ancient Greek in a particular English translation. One is the life of a certain little known historical figure (female) active during the early 20th century. The third is an upcoming book on a certain aspect modern American (US) politics. (There is second newly released modern politics book I might add to the list.) I'll buy from my nearest Barnest & Noble (the only bookstore within an hour's drive) if able. (I expect the Greek translation to will be an online order.)
Decrepit
Earlier today I chanced upon an interview of Guy Gavriel Kay, author of my most recently read novel, The Lions of Al-Rassan. I'd not heard Kay speak before. Turns out he's a masterful talker:

Merging History and the Fantastic with Guy Gavriel Kay (YouTube)

It was recorded soon after publication of his most recent novel, A Brightness Long Ago. Its main focus is on Brightness, but covers much else, including his contribution to Tolkien's Silmarillion, which is more significant than I suspected!

As to Brightness, neither it nor its immediate predecessor are my prime recommendation(s) for someone new to Kay. Those would be:

The Lions of Al-Rassan
A Song for Arbonne
The Sarantine Mosaic (Sailing to Sarantium and Lord of Emperors)
Decrepit
Gave up on the Goodrich King Arthur and am attempting a third read of Tolkien's Silmarillion. Not making much headway. Can't maintain focus for any length of time. Also, various aches and pains while lying down (which is how I do my 'serious' reading) find me frequently shifting position, which breaks concentration. Too, Silmarillion can be a bit daunting at times. Maybe I should settle on something lighter?
SubRosa
I could not maintain much focus when I read the Silmarillion decades ago either. It is the nature of the material. There is no real story or quest. No truly developed characters. It is just a collection of archetypes and a history, not a story. It works great as reference material. But it is awful as a novel. It never should have been published as one. OTOH, what it would be great as is a coffee table book with lots of artwork, and bits of the actual Silmarillion text explaining that this is the Fall of Gondolin, that is Feanor creating the Silmarils, and so on. Star Wars puts a ton of those things out, and they are all really cool to look at.
Kane
I love the Silm. Read it three times now, I think.
Decrepit
QUOTE(Kane @ Feb 12 2020, 12:34 PM) *

I love the Silm. Read it three times now, I think.

I'm rather fond of it too. I will say it's a book I definitely need to be 'in the mood for' before tackling it.

On the way home from a medical appointment yesterday I stopped at our 'local' Barnes & Noble, the only bookstore within reasonable driving distance, '15% off one item' coupon and Gift Card in-hand. Couldn't find what I wanted, but walked out with two Brandon Sanderson novels. The first is Oathbringer book three of The Stormlight Archive. I'm no great Sanderson fanboy. Wasn't overly impressed with Mistborn. Found the first two Stormlight entries a solid improvement. For whatever reason I was never tempted to buy book three, until now. Next up is Edgedancer, a novelette set between books two and three. Read five or so pages of Edgedancer. The writing was uninspired. Nothing wrong with it, and in any case it has a great disadvantage in that it's up against my current read and a work by Guy Gavriel Kay, two authors I consider absolute masters at their craft, cream of the crop. I'm sure I'll enjoy Edgedancer when the time comes.
Kane
QUOTE(Decrepit @ Feb 14 2020, 08:43 AM) *
QUOTE(Kane @ Feb 12 2020, 12:34 PM) *

I love the Silm. Read it three times now, I think.

I'm rather fond of it too. I will say it's a book I definitely need to be 'in the mood for' before tackling it.


Definitely. I only go back to it when I feel like diving into the deep lore again.
Decrepit
Been having so much trouble concentrating lately I was forced to give up on Silmarillion for the time being. Am now reading Brandon Sanderson's Edgedancer. It's a very easy read. I started in on it either very late Tuesday even or sometime Wednesday morning, and am already on page 160!

Having watched a number of Steve Donoghue's Penguin Classics YouTube videos I've developed a yearning for ancient literature, which I've next to no experience with, other than in 'modern' re-tellings and essays. My first thought was to begin with either ancient Rome or Greece. After watching Steve's "Sagalong 2020: Laxdaela Saga", parts 1&2, I decided to buy a Penguin collection entitled Sagas of the Icelanders. Ordered it off Amazon, along with a new pair of 'computer glasses,' a short time ago. (I consider Amazon a great modern evil, yet am as hooked on it as anyone. <sigh>)
Decrepit
At 1721 this afternoon, 21 Feb 2020, at the tail-end of supper, I concluded my initial read of Brandon Sanderson's novelette "Edgedancer." At 250 pages it's somewhat long for a novelette, as Sanderson himself points out in the book's postscript. It's also light and somewhat humorous, exactly what I needed. An easy recommendation for fans of The Stormlight Archive.

Don't yet know if I'll take up Stormlight Archive book 3 next, or settle for another easy, light read.
Decrepit
It seems I'm not only in a gaming slump but a reading slump as well. Since finishing Edgedancer Feb 21 I've started five books, only to abandon them before page 50. One of those five, Penguin Classics Sagas of Icelanders, was rather enjoyable. I might have stuck with it if not for being too decrepit to comfortably hold the book in reading position(s) while lying of the sofa. (It's a large, thick, heavy volume.) Attempting to do so aggravates already bothersome aches and pains. I gave up on it yesterday. I've now started in on Dostoyevsky's The Brothers Karamazov, which I've owned in English translation for decades but never attempted to read. (I believe it was given to me during my long-ago military days.) It's a lightweight paperback edition so triggers no increase in physical discomfort. If the 20-some pages read before falling asleep last night are any indication I might stick with it for the duration.
Decrepit
At 1655 this afternoon, at the end of supper, I concluded a 'read' of Views of Los Angeles by Gernot Kuehn. It feels somewhat amiss to include this book on a reading list. In it, the author collects historical photos of the city shot between the mid 1860s and the 1920s, and compares them to 'modern' photos taken from the same camera positions. Each page contains one photo, with accompanying text. That text is rarely more than a paragraph long, sometimes less. There's not a lot of true reading involved. Still, I read what this is to read in it.

The book is copyrighted 1978. Some of its 'modern' photos might now be hopeless out of date. Not that I would know. I've not been to LA since the early 90s. I'd be interested in a revised version with truly 'modern' photos replacing 70s photos, keeping 70s photos in-place in addition to 'modern' photos when that's appropriate.
SubRosa
I started reading Mr. Midshipman Hornblower, by CS Forester. It is basically a series of short stories rather than a true novel, all about the eponymous Mr. Hornblower. I have watched the A&E TV series half a dozen times, but never tried reading the original books it was based upon.

It is pretty good. Forester is really short on description. He also seems to expect you to understand all the naval jargon, like what a topgallant or mid-deck is. But that aside it is a good adventure story about a young man with a good heart struggling to find his way in the new world of the Royal Navy.
SubRosa
Also forgot to mention. It is the Ides of March. So RIP Caesar and HP Lovecraft.

In his house at R'lyeh
dead Lovecraft waits dreaming
TheCheshireKhajiit
QUOTE(SubRosa @ Mar 15 2020, 08:21 PM) *

Also forgot to mention. It is the Ides of March. So RIP Caesar and HP Lovecraft.

In his house at R'lyeh
dead Lovecraft waits dreaming


RIP Mr. Lovecraft. As for Caesar, f* that guy. He got what he deserved, especially after what he had done to Vercingetorix. Bad form that (and I doubt that was the worst thing he did).
SubRosa
QUOTE(TheCheshireKhajiit @ Mar 15 2020, 11:23 PM) *

QUOTE(SubRosa @ Mar 15 2020, 08:21 PM) *

Also forgot to mention. It is the Ides of March. So RIP Caesar and HP Lovecraft.

In his house at R'lyeh
dead Lovecraft waits dreaming


RIP Mr. Lovecraft. As for Caesar, f* that guy. He got what he deserved, especially after what he had done to Vercingetorix. Bad form that (and I doubt that was the worst thing he did).

I am a little befuddled. I was under the impression that Vercingetorix was strangled during Caesar's triumph, as per Roman custom? That's pretty tame. Way better than how William Wallace went out, or Crassus.
Decrepit
At 1311 this afternoon, Sunday, 5 April 2020, I concluded my fourth-plus read of Bruce Catton's Mr. Lincoln's Army, book one of his Army of the Potomac. I've owned the book since Mar 1976. It has been a favorite ever since. Catton remains my favorite writer US Civil War history. This series isn't a comprehensive overview of the War, but instead the War as experienced by the Union's premier army. (Catton wrote both a single-volume and three-volume comprehensive overview. I owned the three-volume overview years ago. I no longer do. Can't remember why or when it disappeared from my library.) The man knew how to write compelling narrative! Here's a sample drawn from the chapter Opportunity Knocks Three Times, its closing two paragraphs:

"They tramped for several miles and finally were halted on somebody's farm to the north and east of where Hooker's men were posted. General Mansfield spread a blanket for himself on the grass in a fence corner next to a field where the 10th Maine had turned in. The Maine boys were wakeful and did a lot of chattering - the march in the rain had roused them, and thought of what was coming in the morning made it hard to go back to sleep - and the old general got up once and went over to shush them. They recalled that he was nice about it and not at all like a major general: just told them that if they had to talk they might as well do it in a whisper so that their comrades could get a little rest. And at last, long after midnight, there was quiet and the army slept a little.

How far they had marched, those soldiers - down the lanes and cross-lots over the cornfields to get into position, and from the distant corners of the country before that; they were marching, really, out of one era and into another, leaving much behind them, going ahead to much that they did not know about. For some of them there were just a few steps left: from the rumpled grass of a bed in a pasture down to a fence or a thicket where there would be an appointment with a flying bullet of shell fragment, the miraculous and infinitely complicated trajectory of the man meeting the flat, whining trajectory of the bullet without fail. And while they slept the lazy, rainy breeze drifted through the East Wood and the West Wood and the cornfield, and riffled over the copings of the stone bridge to the south, touching them for the last time before dead men made them famous. The flags were all furled and the bugles stilled, and the hot metal of the guns on the ridges had cooled, and the army was asleep - tenting tonight on the old camp ground, with never a song to cheer because the voices that might sing it were all stilled on this most crowded and most lonely of fields. And whatever it may be that nerves men to die for a flag or a phrase or a man or an inexpressible dream was drowsing with them, ready to wake with the dawn."

(Needless to say, any and all errors in the above quote rest solely with my poor typing and proofing skills.)
SubRosa
That writing is pure gold.
Renee
Which is correct? Should 'ending' punctuation be placed inside of parenthesis? Or outside?

Reading books, growing up, I always saw punctuation placed outside (like this).

But more and more often, especially on the 'net, I often see it placed inside parenthesis (like this.)

To me, method 2 is wrong. mad.gif I can't help thinking it's just people not really getting their grammar right on the internet.

But I also have noticed ending inside punctuation is becoming more popular in physical books. I first noticed it in a book I read about Enron a couple years ago called The Smartest Guys in the Room. In this book, I began to see punctuation placed inside of parenthesis, and at first I thought these were typos. All published material has typos. I've been in the habit all my life of noticing them, and even circling them (if it's my own book). In fact, the writer(s) of Smartest Guys in the Room seemed confused about which method is correct. Sometimes ending punctuation would get placed outside of parenthesis. Most of the time it was inside, though.

Maybe these were oversights in that Enron book. But then I recently read a sci-fi book called Dark Matter. Again, punctuation is always placed inside. indifferent.gif Maybe I am wrong, but are there actual literary rules concerning where punctuation is to go nowadays? Those who have taken English courses in the last decade might have an answer. smile.gif
Decrepit
QUOTE(Renee @ Apr 9 2020, 09:03 AM) *

Which is correct? Should 'ending' punctuation be placed inside of parenthesis? Or outside?

Reading books, growing up, I always saw punctuation placed outside (like this).

But more and more often, especially on the 'net, I often see it placed inside parenthesis (like this.)

To me, method 2 is wrong. mad.gif I can't help thinking it's just people not really getting their grammar right on the internet.

But I also have noticed ending inside punctuation is becoming more popular in physical books. I first noticed it in a book I read about Enron a couple years ago called The Smartest Guys in the Room. In this book, I began to see punctuation placed inside of parenthesis, and at first I thought these were typos. All published material has typos. I've been in the habit all my life of noticing them, and even circling them (if it's my own book). In fact, the writer(s) of Smartest Guys in the Room seemed confused about which method is correct. Sometimes ending punctuation would get placed outside of parenthesis. Most of the time it was inside, though.

Maybe these were oversights in that Enron book. But then I recently read a sci-fi book called Dark Matter. Again, punctuation is always placed inside. indifferent.gif Maybe I am wrong, but are there actual literary rules concerning where punctuation is to go nowadays? Those who have taken English courses in the last decade might have an answer. smile.gif

So far as parenthesis is concerned, I'm with you. A sentence ending just doesn't look right with punctuation placed inside, unless the entire sentence is included within parenthesis of course. I have more trouble deciding where ending quotation marks go in like situations.
treydog
Per my go-to resource, The Chicago Manual of Style-

A period precedes the closing parenthesis if the entire sentence is in parentheses, otherwise it follows the closing parenthesis.

Trey approached silently. (He was a thief, after all.)

Trey's approach was silent (an important aspect of being a thief).
Renee
That's weird. I've never seen punctuation placed inside of quotes in older books. Or maybe I've never noticed it, but i think I would have. Anyway, thanks for answers!

QUOTE
I have more trouble deciding where ending quotation marks go in like situations.


This is something I've probably gotten wrong half the time when I was writing in my youth. Going into my 40s (and especially writing here at Chorrol) it is something I've been paying attention to. "I thought quotations always go outside of ending punctuation," is the way I've always noticed this, now that I am paying attention. "But in my past, I've sometimes put ending punctuation outside of quotes", "sometimes inside of quotes."

trey?
treydog
The preferred placement is as you suggest... comma or period inside the closing quotation mark.


Colon, semicolon, question mark, exclamation point- OUTSIDE the closing quotation mark, unless the question mark or exclamation point is part of the material being quoted. That seems strange to me- as example below

The district attorney asked,"And did you hear what the policeman said"?

He said, "Halt criminal scum!"

I would incline toward putting both of those inside....
Renee
Awesome, thanks trey. smile.gif
Decrepit
Along with the movie 1917, yesterday's Amazon order-arrival contained the book Caesar by Colleen McCullough. It's the fifth(?) entry in her Masters of Rome series. I bought and read preceding entries as they appeared on Barnes & Noble shelves. For whatever reason Caesar, first published 1998, never showed up at my local B&N. Not long ago I gave up hope of ever seeing it there, so ordered it off Amazon. Just as well, as our B&N was, as I've mentioned before, wrecked by a tornado two weeks ago.

It joins an ever-growing stack of TBR titles. Recently acquired TBRs, aside from Caesar, are Oathbringer (Brandon Sanderson), Unworthy Republic - The Dispossession of Native Amercans and the Road to Indian Territories (Claudio Saunt), and The Sagas of Iclanders, a Penquin Classic. Sagas and Unworthy are acquisitions based on Steve Donoghue recommendations. (My hands-down favorite BookTuber.) I also began reading The Brothers Karamazov (Dostoyevsky) a while back and need to finish it. Last in the stack is Chariots of the Gods? (von Daniken) It's the only book in the stack I've read before, way back in the early 1970s. I found it fascinating 'food for thought' back then. I'm curious to see what I think of it now. Less, I suspect. But who's to say?

The problem with all this is that I've been in a reading slump for months. Try as I might, I rarely read more than 10-20 pages a day. Just can't maintain concentration. (The same goes for gaming. Don't let my weekly train-related YouTube video uploads fool you.)

At present, I am re-reading Bruce Catton's Glory Road, book two of his The Army of the Potomac series, a non-fiction history of the US Civil War's premier Union Army. Reading the series this time round puts me in mind of Robert Jordan's Wheel of Time in the way Catton shifts the series' tone at the war progresses, much as Wheel shifts into the 'slump' - as some consider it - mid-series.
ghastley
I thought Glory Road was a familiar title, but I didn't recall the author. It turns out that the one I read was by Robert Heinlein.
Decrepit
At 1340 this afternoon, 25 Apr 2020, I concluded a re-read of Bruce Catton's The Army of the Potomac: Glory Road. This series being a favorite of mine, I'll likely continue on with book three, A Stillness at Appomattox. That's not a given. As slow a reader as I've become, it can take so long to finish a book that by its end I'm ready to move on to something different, regardless of how much I like it.
Decrepit
At 2213 yesterday evening I finished Bruce Catton's A Stillness at Appomattox, bringing to a close another reading of his Army of the Potomac series chronicling the US Civil War's premier Union army. My one quibble with the series is that this final volume ends abruptly with Lee's Army of Northern Virginia at last brought to bay, trapped beyond redemption, the armies paused facing one another one final time, realizing that it's at last over. Catton chooses not to cover the actual surrender, the army's disbanding, or postwar lives of members of the Army. Still, it's a favorite US Civil War series, and an easy recommendation.
Decrepit
At 1401 this afternoon I concluded a fourth read of Jonathan Wylie's The Lightless Kingdom, book two of his three-book The Unbalanced Earth Trilogy. I read book one months ago but couldn't at that time locate books two and three. Chanced upon them soon after finishing A Stillness at Appomattox and decided to continue on.

I have acquired The Last Wish, introduction to The Witcher series by Andrej Sapkowski. It is added to an already too numerous pile of new TBR titles.
Decrepit
At 0334 this morning, 10 Jun 2020, I concluded my fourth read of Jonathon Wylie's The Age of Chaos, bringing to an end his The Unbalanced Earth Trilogy. While I don't consider these 'must reads', they are enjoyable and easy to keep focus on during these screwy, distracting times.

I've not decided on what to tackle next, but am mildly leaning toward an initial reading of the Witcher series introduction.
Decrepit
At 1303 this afternoon a concluded my initial read of The Last Wish, introduction to Andrzej Sapkowski's Witcher[b] series. Having neither seen the Netflix series nor played the games, I didn't know what to expect from this book. I guessed that it was serious, dark, and violent. Instead, it's light, often witty, humorous, even whimsical. I like it no less for that. I'll go so far to say that during this bleak, ever screwier times, its light nature worked in its favor.

I intend to continue reading the series. Which means I need to place an order with Amazon, our one local bookstore having been demolished during a late April tornado. Come to think on it, there's a second book I want to order, plus one movie.
Decrepit
My Amazon order just arrived, containing three Witcher volumes: Sword of Destiny, Blood of Elves and Season of Storms. I originally planned to order only Season of Storms, having read on a website that Storms contains material that is a direct continuation of events in The Last Wish. Then, another website told me that, yes, Storms contains continuing material, but also contains spoilers for the rest of the series if read second. Not liking spoilers, I decided to order/read Sword of Destiny instead, and the next volume too. For some reason I decided to keep Storms in my cart, so it's here as well.

As for what I'm reading now, it's The First Book of Swords by Fred Saberhagen. I read it twice before, most recently 1994. As you might imagine, I remember almost nothing about it. So little it all seems new and fresh.
Decrepit
At 0948 this morning I concluded my third read of Fred Saberhagen's The First Book of Swords. An OK fantasy (with sci-fi vibes thrown in) for and of its time (1983). I now debate whether to continue with the Swords Trilogy or return to The Witcher series.
Jacki Dice
I started reading Icebound by Dean Koontz. I've heard this is a unique story type for him. It's not supernatural or secret government doings/mind control. So far, it's more man vs nature.
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